The Doctor Who Thread

[Boosteroo Corpse Trainee Find all posts View Profile Close Boosteroo]

You know. It could be possible for her to be a Gallifreian and NOT be a Time Lord... the Doctor's granddaughter was from Gallifrey, but she wasn't a TIme Lord. Time Lords aren't really a race, per say, they're more just the "high society" of Gallifrey. This established throughout the classic series in various instances (his granddaughter not being a Time Lord just being the most notable).

That said, I don't think she's going to be a Time Lord, a Gallifreian, or anything of the sort. There are other time travellers out there. Maybe she's a renegade time cop like Captain Jack, or maybe she stole one of their time manipulators. We don't know. We've never actually seen how she travels when she's on her own, have we?

[Boosteroo Corpse Trainee Find all posts View Profile Close Boosteroo]

I don't think it would need to be a Time Lord body. Even if River was a Time Lady (which I don't think she is), she could inhabit a compatible alien body. The master did it in "The Keeper of Trakken."

He also did it in the movie AFTER HE HAD DIED... but it was established there that the body would deteriate, just like we've seen in this new series with the Tardis and the DoctorDonna. Anyway, whatever happens, I'm sure we won't be able to guess it appropriately here. If Moffat is good at anything, its keeping the viewers on their toes.

[Space Cop The Dandy Find all posts View Profile Close Space Cop]

You know. It could be possible for her to be a Gallifreian and NOT be a Time Lord... the Doctor's granddaughter was from Gallifrey, but she wasn't a TIme Lord. Time Lords aren't really a race, per say, they're more just the "high society" of Gallifrey. This established throughout the classic series in various instances (his granddaughter not being a Time Lord just being the most notable).

That said, I don't think she's going to be a Time Lord, a Gallifreian, or anything of the sort. There are other time travellers out there. Maybe she's a renegade time cop like Captain Jack, or maybe she stole one of their time manipulators. We don't know. We've never actually seen how she travels when she's on her own, have we?

That's still widely debated among Whovians. It's an argument from silence: that sometimes Gallifeyans aren't referred to as Time Lords, but that doesn't mean there not. I think they all are, including Susan. There are times when he's clearly referring to a race of people as Time Lords. And the third doctor referred to Time Lords as "my people" (not my class, my degree, my station etc.).

[Boosteroo Corpse Trainee Find all posts View Profile Close Boosteroo]

That's still widely debated among Whovians. It's an argument from silence: that sometimes Gallifeyans aren't referred to as Time Lords, but that doesn't mean there not. I think they all are, including Susan. There are times when he's clearly referring to a race of people as Time Lords. And the third doctor referred to Time Lords as "my people" (not my class, my degree, my station etc.).

"Geeks are my people." But geeks aren't a race, they're a non-bioogical subtype. Furthermore, Susan is very specifically established as NOT being a Time Lord... look it up. Also, some of the fifth and sixth Doctor stories make mention of Gallifrey having more than just Time Lords... but Time Lords were the upper ruling class. Can't think of any instances off hand, and I'm not going to research it, but I think there was a mention in The Five Doctors about it in passing... and regardless, I know this bit of info to be fact. That said, if they ignored that in the nuWho, it wouldn't surpirse me, nor would it be the first time they chose to ignore something previously established. Hell, the Doctor's age should be easy to research as writers, but somehow they managed to make the 9th Doctor and onward YOUNGER than the 7th Doctor (who specifically claims his age to be 953) and quite moreso the 8th Doctor (who figures his age to be about 1012). So yeah.

[Lantern of Gallifrey Senior Corps Member Find all posts View Profile Close Lantern of Gallifrey]

There was an episode, I think it was Tom Baker, where he took Lela to Galifrey and she met some people that lived outside of the Ciadel. They were very much like "cavemen" but it still doesn't say if they regenerate, or at least I don't think it does.

[Space Cop The Dandy Find all posts View Profile Close Space Cop]

"Geeks are my people." But geeks aren't a race, they're a non-bioogical subtype. Furthermore, Susan is very specifically established as NOT being a Time Lord... look it up. Also, some of the fifth and sixth Doctor stories make mention of Gallifrey having more than just Time Lords... but Time Lords were the upper ruling class. Can't think of any instances off hand, and I'm not going to research it, but I think there was a mention in The Five Doctors about it in passing... and regardless, I know this bit of info to be fact. That said, if they ignored that in the nuWho, it wouldn't surpirse me, nor would it be the first time they chose to ignore something previously established. Hell, the Doctor's age should be easy to research as writers, but somehow they managed to make the 9th Doctor and onward YOUNGER than the 7th Doctor (who specifically claims his age to be 953) and quite moreso the 8th Doctor (who figures his age to be about 1012). So yeah.

When does it say that Susan wasn't a Time Lord? You must refer to a book or play (which aren't canon) because she leaves during the first doctor and the first time "Time Lords" are mentioned by name is in "War Zone" when the second doctor specifically says "They're Time Lords, Zoe, they're my people."

There is no one time when they say in the show definitively "these are Gallifreyans who are not Time Lords." That's why it is still debated in Who fandom, because there is no such instance. The creators mention this in their commentaries too. Different writers took it different ways, so some episodes sound more definitively like it refers to the whole species while others don't.
This is a real debate among Who fans for that reason. If there were places that clearly stated it does not mean the race, it wouldn't be a debate among the die hards.

BTW: the wiki article (and yeah, I know you can't trust wikipedia) on Time Lords begins "The Time Lords are a fictional extraterrestrial race and civilization of humanoids in the British science fiction television series Doctor Who, of which the series' main character, the Doctor, is a member."

And yeah, nuWho definitely goes the route of equating them with a species. In "The Beast Below," when Amy says the Doctor (11th) looks human, he says "No, you look Time Lord. We were here first." That really only makes sense if he's talking about a species and not a degree or aristocracy.

There was an episode, I think it was Tom Baker, where he took Lela to Galifrey and she met some people that lived outside of the Ciadel. They were very much like "cavemen" but it still doesn't say if they regenerate, or at least I don't think it does.

Yep, but again, they don't specifically say that they're not Time Lords, just that they don't live with the others, in their society.

[Space Cop The Dandy Find all posts View Profile Close Space Cop]

Just saw "Terror of the Autons" for the first time. Great stuff: introduction of the Master and Jo Grant. Killer plastic ordinary objects.

[Boosteroo Corpse Trainee Find all posts View Profile Close Boosteroo]

The audio plays (or at least the 8th Doctor ones) are, for the most part, by and large canonical.
Its established therein when the 8th Doctor finally visits Susan that she is not a Time Lord.

[Dr Warren Alan's Drycleaner Find all posts View Profile Close Dr Warren]

Just saw "Terror of the Autons" for the first time. Great stuff: introduction of the Master and Jo Grant. Killer plastic ordinary objects.

season 8 is still one of my favorite eras of dr who episodes. every episode plays into a larger conflict between the master, the doctor, the other timelords and UNIT
good stuff

[Lantern of Gallifrey Senior Corps Member Find all posts View Profile Close Lantern of Gallifrey]

I just found this. I thought it was funny.

[Lantern of Gallifrey Senior Corps Member Find all posts View Profile Close Lantern of Gallifrey]

I have a question. What sector do you think Gallifrey would be in?

[Boosteroo Corpse Trainee Find all posts View Profile Close Boosteroo]

Its not.

[Darth_Andrea Owned by Natu Find all posts View Profile Close Darth_Andrea]

Darth_Andrea

[Lantern of Gallifrey Senior Corps Member Find all posts View Profile Close Lantern of Gallifrey]

It will be interesting to see how this Doctor clone acts. And if he is a Timelord can he regenerate. I remember from the old series that regernerations are given to Timelords. That was why the Valeyard wanted the Doctors remaining regenerations. And in the episode with Paul Mcgann the Master wanted them to. I hope that I am remembering all this right. Which brings up another question. How did the Master regenerate if he was out of regenerations?

[chivalrous Corps Honor Guard Find all posts View Profile Close chivalrous]

I was hoping after the lightning strike, that they would all turn out to be clones and the originals have all run off in the TARDIS.

About the only thing of interest this week, was the question of how you deal with having an identical doppleganger. Annoyed that they're dragging it out into 2 episodes, Pleased that Rory is getting more assertive; Amused at Rory's "you get used to it" comment; Ignoring everyone who suggests that the Doctor clone was wearing the space suit in the first episode.