Do women love men who are jerks?

[Jay Burg]

LOL. Your posts always make me chuckle. "Winners go home and f__k the prom Queen."

Exactly.

And the losers end up marrying her sloppy seconds.

[Rotten2thecorps]

I often wonder if it is a phsycal thing? I often find I have little in common with women who I find attractive. Yet the ones I do not find actractive are usually the more intresting. But I am shallow so.... there is that.

[Rotten2thecorps]

No, that's you rejecting the two logical outcomes without supplying an alternative. It isn't a conclusion, since it doesn't choose one or the other.



I don't think I'm splitting hairs. I think I'm pointing out a possible problem with your theory that most women prefer jerks. I'm saying that, unless you agree to one of those two possibilities, then your theory does not fit observed reality. It might fit the small corner of reality you have direct experience with, I can't say. But there are all kinds of women out there choosing to become closely linked in some way with all kinds of guys. You can't get away from the fact that, if what you say is true, either a heck of a lot of those guys (most, apparently) are jerks, or a heck of a lot of those women are choosing to pair up with guys they don't like.

Maybe one of those things is true. I don't think it is, based solely on my own experiences and personal knowledge, but I could well be wrong. But if your assertion is correct, it sure seem logical that ONE of them HAS to be true.

As to why I don't buy into the notion that most women prefer jerks? My personal experiences give no indication of such a preference. In fact, in the cases I've known where women were dating a guy who seemed to be a jerk, what they had to say about it suggested that they liked the guy for some OTHER reason, and wished he WASN'T a jerk. I've seen no indication among women I've known personally that they are ever attracted to somebody BECAUSE they are a jerk. And since I would describe a jerk as unpleasant, and preferring something because it is unpleasant seems kind of mental, and in my experience women are not, as a class, any more mental than guys, I don't have a hard time believing that they don't prefer stuff because it is unpleasant...

I am not going to answer this because already covered it. You may not have liked the answer and are welcome to spin it how you wish. But I am not going to debate a conclusion you've drawn,that is a jump away from the topic at hand. Do Women prefer men who are jerks. I say yes. I agree to your earlier that in some cases it is men just justfying why they are not have some one. However again that is a jump away from the heart of the post as well. How ever I am intrested in some counter expirences.

I love hearing about peoples stories,and find it reveals much more then the common Post counter post metality of messages boards.

[Mister Ed]

LOL. Your posts always make me chuckle. "Winners go home and f__k the prom Queen."

Not all nice guys finish last. Nice guys with a backbone get their fair share of pie. It's the push-over's that finish last. A woman wants someone that's confident, assertive and takes control, not someone that will bend and break. It's possible to be the former.

I think Sylent has really hit on something. I'd love to hear what a female thought of this idea, but I can easily believe that the real distinctive is one of confidence vs. hesitance. A guy who isn't a jerk but can barely manage to talk to a girl isn't going to get anywhere in most cases, wheras a guy who is confident might be able to make women look past some of their jerkish tendencies. I would think, though, that given a choice between a confident nice guy and a confident jerk, most women would prefer the less jerky option. The jerks will probably win out when the competition is a nice wallflower.

[Sylent_Asassin]

Nice guys finish last.

Don't be that guy. Be a jerk. Get some pu-tang pie. Finish first.

LOL. Your posts always make me chuckle. "Winners go home and f__k the prom Queen."

Not all nice guys finish last. Nice guys with a backbone get their fair share of pie. It's the push-over's that finish last. A woman wants someone that's confident, assertive and takes control, not someone that will bend and break. It's possible to be the former.

[Mister Ed]

But it does not. That is a conclusion.

No, that's you rejecting the two logical outcomes without supplying an alternative. It isn't a conclusion, since it doesn't choose one or the other.

You are kinda splitting hairs. How about we focous less on your theroy,I would be intrested in hearing about what expieriences have made you champion the other side of the the discussion.

I don't think I'm splitting hairs. I think I'm pointing out a possible problem with your theory that most women prefer jerks. I'm saying that, unless you agree to one of those two possibilities, then your theory does not fit observed reality. It might fit the small corner of reality you have direct experience with, I can't say. But there are all kinds of women out there choosing to become closely linked in some way with all kinds of guys. You can't get away from the fact that, if what you say is true, either a heck of a lot of those guys (most, apparently) are jerks, or a heck of a lot of those women are choosing to pair up with guys they don't like.

Maybe one of those things is true. I don't think it is, based solely on my own experiences and personal knowledge, but I could well be wrong. But if your assertion is correct, it sure seem logical that ONE of them HAS to be true.

As to why I don't buy into the notion that most women prefer jerks? My personal experiences give no indication of such a preference. In fact, in the cases I've known where women were dating a guy who seemed to be a jerk, what they had to say about it suggested that they liked the guy for some OTHER reason, and wished he WASN'T a jerk. I've seen no indication among women I've known personally that they are ever attracted to somebody BECAUSE they are a jerk. And since I would describe a jerk as unpleasant, and preferring something because it is unpleasant seems kind of mental, and in my experience women are not, as a class, any more mental than guys, I don't have a hard time believing that they don't prefer stuff because it is unpleasant...

[Jay Burg]

Women won't admit to this truth.

[Mister Ed]

We need a female to voice an opinion.

I too would welcome it, though I'm not sure it will help. In my past experience with people asserting that most women like jerks, any women that dissented were dismissed with either "You're atypical" or else, "Of course you'd SAY that" depending on how much the people involved liked that particular woman.

And, to be fair, if a woman came in here and said, "Yeah, we DO prefer jerks" I'D be the one saying that I thought they were atypical. So I can't really fault them on those grounds without being hypocritical, I suppose.

[Jay Burg]

Nice guys finish last.

Don't be that guy. Be a jerk. Get some pu-tang pie. Finish first.

[Rotten2thecorps]

No, it isn't conclusion jumping, I provided two options. We were talking about what women like. If you are right that MOST women prefer jerks, that should mean that EITHER most women are in a relationship with jerks, OR most women in relationships are with men they don't like. Your last sentence seem to imply that you think the latter is the explanation. Women prefer jerks, but start relationships with non-jerks instead because... reasons and stuff.

But it does not. That is a conclusion. You are kinda splitting hairs. How about we focous less on your theroy,I would be intrested in hearing about what expieriences have made you champion the other side of the the discussion.

[Darth_Primus]

We need a female to voice an opinion.

To some men, I don't think if a woman is a jerk it's a deal breaker. However, typically women with bad attitudes aren't called jerks, but rather bitches.

[Rotten2thecorps]

I think you are underthinking it.

I'm not saying that marriage and dating are the same thing, except insofar that they are both relationships that you get into with somebody you LIKE (hopefully, anyway).

You are saying that most women like jerks. That SHOULD mean that most romantic relationships between a woman and a man will be between a woman and a jerk, shouldn't it? Or else that a whole lot of women are getting into romantic relationships with guys they don't like. Those options follow logically from your premise.



Well, that question is only worthy of a separate thread for those that accept your initial premise that MOST women prefer jerks, of course.

Unfortunatley we form these opinions off of life experiences. and I honesty it's all we really can trust,and far as we can trust it. I base my research frm alot of bad expieriences. I have many friends who are divorced,the one who is not,treats his wife a little mean. He knows he does it yet still does it! And she complains yet never takes any sort of action. I love them both,but they are crazy,yet they have the strongest realtionship of any one I know?

Then I got my mom. My oldman treated her like crap. They have been divorced for over 28 years,yet she almost swons over him every time she talks about how abusive he was. and always follows it with,I will always love that man.

Another thing is I use to sit behind, these 4 beautiful girls in school. To hear them talk about thier men,was truly disturbing. The things they say they wanted and the things they put up with. would amaze and frighten.

[Mister Ed]

But that is conclusion jumping. We are talking atractivness,not nessecarly realtionships. Realtionships is a whole diffrent ball game. You can be with a person for all kinds of reasons.

No, it isn't conclusion jumping, I provided two options. We were talking about what women like. If you are right that MOST women prefer jerks, that should mean that EITHER most women are in a relationship with jerks, OR most women in relationships are with men they don't like. Your last sentence seem to imply that you think the latter is the explanation. Women prefer jerks, but start relationships with non-jerks instead because... reasons and stuff.

[Sylent_Asassin]

I'm not so sure about your opposition of "nice guy" and "fun and outgoing". In my experience the people of who I would say they are a "nice guy", they are generally among the outgoing ones. I think it is difficult to be seen as nice by others if you aren't being nice TO them, which kind of requires social interaction that the introvert doesn't do well. My brother-in-law is one of the nicest guys I've ever met, and the reason I feel that way is that he's so fun and pleasant to be around.

There is just so much grey area here. I mean, all nice guys, whether they admit not, have some jerk tendencies in them. It just depends on what pushes their buttons. In addition, some people are better at hiding their jerk tendencies, therefore labeled as a nice guy.

It's funny (well, not really) how the nice guy, much of the time is the one that goes on rampages and does something crazy in public. Then, you hear on the news about how they were so quiet and nice.

[Tazer]

Yo.

Some women love men who are jerks. That's indisputable.

Do all women love men who are jerks? No. That's also indisputable.

/thread




Tazer