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Old 12-23-2019, 06:48 PM   #14951
Michael Heide
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But if you take away the constructs, what makes it different from the Nova Corps or the Lensmen?
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Old 12-23-2019, 07:13 PM   #14952
Trey Strain
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Originally Posted by Michael Heide View Post
But if you take away the constructs, what makes it different from the Nova Corps or the Lensmen?
A while back, some people were bitching about the GLC because "they all have the same powers."

Steve Englehart replied to them, "It ain't about the powers."

If it were about the powers, then the Martian Manhunter would be the biggest star in comics, because he's got billions and billions and billions of powers. And Batman would be a nonentity, because he's got no powers at all. But in terms of their popularity, it's exactly the other was around, isn't it?

Meanwhile, look at all this convoluted shit. How are you going to do this in a movie, and who is going to care about it even if you do? Just flush it all down into the sewage system where it belongs and reboot it, much simplified.

Besides, even if it were simplified with a reboot, Green Lantern would still be too big a story to tell in a movie. You need the time that a television series would give you.

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Old 12-23-2019, 10:19 PM   #14953
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A version of Emerald Twilight could make an expanded DCEU interesting while rebooting the character[s] for their own franchise, while also setting up Justice League films around the concepts of Zero Hour and Final Night.
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Old 12-26-2019, 03:26 PM   #14954
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Green Lantern would make a much better television series than a movie -- especially if they'd lose the ring constructs, which would get the budgets under control. But Geoff would never figure that out in a million years.
The energy constructs ARE Green Lantern! What you could do is start off with Hal Jordan's "1950" boxing glove, brick wall, scissors, etc. Give the computers the time to make more complex constructs later in the series with John Stewart, Kyle Rayner, etc. Hal and Guy can just be Plain Janes until then. Guy has baseball bats, guns, lift platforms, etc.

Just like with T2 the movie, what is expensive today should be cheaper tomorrow. But no CGI faces, please. Like said above, use CGI for the costume change, but get a green-and-black thick leotard with some plastic molded pieces for normal costume shots.
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Old 12-27-2019, 03:06 AM   #14955
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Ninety-nine percent of television views don't know jack about Green Lantern. They won't say "But where are the ring constructs?"

Furthermore, a lot of people, if they saw them, would say to their children, "Hey Billy and Janie. There's a new kids show on now. Come check it out."

As I said earlier, it's not about the powers.

It's too bad I ain't gonna have time to write the show...


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Old 12-27-2019, 02:31 PM   #14956
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Its like if somebody took away the webs and wall crawling from Spider-Man.

If you like generic heroes, then by all means keep pushing for them to be cardboard cut-outs from the 60's. I don't think HBO Max's GL or even the movie itself if it still gets made will be THAT geared towards children. If that's what they were worried about then we'd have got a shitty PG-13 Joker, Aquaman action figures in every Wal-Mart, etc.

The only time GL even *kinda* worked without constructs was the very early seasons of the Justice League cartoon, but eventually even they realized you can't have a GL who only makes energy beams and force bubbles and they corrected their mistakes. John Stewart was too boring, and if not for them tacking on a military backstory he would've been an even worse character in those earlier episodes.

It would be easier to ask for a character like the Ray to get reimagined again instead of insisting they dumb another character down.
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Old 12-27-2019, 04:05 PM   #14957
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Have two producers and two production crews. Have the four Lanterns get their rings in the two-part premiere story, then peel John off for Justice League and Kyle off for Titans.

The model would be the old Combat series, where Vic Morrow and Rick Jason alternated in the lead. Have an Earth episode one week with Hal, then a space episode the next week with Guy. The two would occasionally team up for an episode. Of course the format would be procedural, not serialized.

Most but not all Guy episodes would start with his receiving an assignment from the CPB, like the way the Mission: Impossible series opened.

I think a lot of writers have forgotten how to write a procedural, if they ever knew. But hey.

The big thing to remember is that unlike message-board mavens, television views don't know or give a shit about Green Lantern history. They won't throw a fit if Hal doesn't specifically get Abin Sur's ring, or something like that.

Which is good.

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Old 12-30-2019, 06:23 AM   #14958
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jhpace1 View Post
The energy constructs ARE Green Lantern! What you could do is start off with Hal Jordan's "1950" boxing glove, brick wall, scissors, etc. Give the computers the time to make more complex constructs later in the series with John Stewart, Kyle Rayner, etc. Hal and Guy can just be Plain Janes until then. Guy has baseball bats, guns, lift platforms, etc.
.
That's true. The rings aren't just weapons, but an extension of the wielder's personality. As in the case of Soranik making surgical implements, it's a key narrative device beyond just the battles.
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Old 12-30-2019, 01:14 PM   #14959
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It's a huge pile of Silver Age silliness that should have been junked long ago.

Let's see. Sinestro is an asshole, so he should make a giant anus with his ring that blasts his enemies with asphyxiating farts. Wouldn't that be COOL?

If Geoff had junked the ring constructs, everybody on the message boards would still be gushing about how he had brought Green Lantern into the modern world and had made it for grown-ups.

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Old 12-30-2019, 01:32 PM   #14960
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Couldn't disagree more.
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Old 12-30-2019, 01:33 PM   #14961
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Couldn't disagree more.
Yeah, well. You could make a GL television show that's all about the ring constructs, and forty fanboys on the message boards would squeal with delight. But nobody would watch it.

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Old 12-30-2019, 01:49 PM   #14962
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Why just the two extremes? No constructs or "all about the ring constructs"? You do know there's a gray area in-between that false binary?
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Old 12-30-2019, 02:04 PM   #14963
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Why just the two extremes? No constructs or "all about the ring constructs"? You do know there's a gray area in-between that false binary?
Space Cop and Mr. Ed have said exactly that -- that Green Lantern is all about the ring constructs. And you yourself have said that the ring constructs are the only thing that differentiates GL from several other concepts.

I call hogwash on that. But in any case, either they're in the show or they're not. And if they're in, then every time a GL uses his ring, they're liable to pop up.

Here's the rub though: Anything a power ring can do with a ring construct, it can do just as well without one.

So what's the use of them? Why are they there?

If it's "I think they're cool," then you're entitled to think so. But I think they're the furthest thing from cool. I think they're stupid.

Conversely, if their purpose is to display the personality of the user, then the way to do that is through his behavior.

Have you been to the Qward forum lately? I've discussed the setting up of a television show over there. It's a complex process, with much to consider. The main thing to consider is how to attract enough viewers to stay on the air.

Sometimes the history of other shows can serve as a guide, but often you have to use your judgment about what will draw viewers and what will push them away. That's why it's an art and not a science.

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Old 12-31-2019, 04:32 AM   #14964
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It's a huge pile of Silver Age silliness that should have been junked long ago.
.
Doing away with the constructs might kill Green Lantern as a viable property in all forms of media. What makes Lantern stories special is their versatility. There are grounded stories where they fight without their rings or new users struggle to learn their powers. Conversely, veteran ring slingers come up with innovative ways to solve problems and take on top-tier powered villains. Take away the constructs, and the Corps becomes a homogenized group with powers that are more identifiable with other characters. It would absolutely gut the Green Lantern mythos.
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Old 12-31-2019, 11:49 AM   #14965
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I’ve said that the ring constructs are a defining element of the character. I don’t think that’s the same thing as saying the comic is all about the constructs, but we could just be misunderstanding exactly what we mean by our respective statements.

Trey seems to be heavily invested in the idea that the presence of any constructs at all is unbearable, and makes the property into a goofy kiddie property. I don’t know that there is any solid evidence for that contention, just Trey’s personal sensibilities and anecdotal evidence about what he’s heard from various other individuals. Whereas I feel that the many, many years of Green Lantern, in various incarnations and by various creators, ALL of which have involved a ring that creates constructs based on the user’s thoughts, clearly establish that as an integral part of the concept. If that is really too kiddie and silly, then it seems to me that would mean that Green Lantern is intrinsically too kiddie and silly, and one would be better served to create a new concept than to change this one so drastically.

If Green Lantern can only succeed by eliminating a core element of the character, then it seems like one is really saying, “Green Lantern can’t succeed, but maybe we can make something different that can, then just stick the Green Lantern name on it for some reason, even though the only people to whom that name will be a draw are the people that liked the “kiddy” character that’s been around for decades.”
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Old 01-01-2020, 08:40 PM   #14966
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Trey seems to be heavily invested in the idea that the presence of any constructs at all is unbearable, and makes the property into a goofy kiddie property.
Comics were made for kids originally. Sounds to me like he's barely a fan of GL or any monthly comic for that matter and on the wrong forum. It's hilarious how somebody who doesn't read anything wants to trash the medium and specific titles on the regular. He might as well be one of those women who doesn't read comics but feels the need to bitch about how women are drawn in them like they DO read them.

And contrary to popular belief, you can only do so much with force bubbles and energy beams. It got old quick in the cartoons, it'd get old in comics and live action tv/movies just as fast. You can do a lot more with a fifty feet tall mecha. Seeing regular energy blast through a wall is nowhere near as appealing to the eye as a guy creating a giant bull, a half dozen firemen, or a green Kool-Aid guy.
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Old 01-01-2020, 10:01 PM   #14967
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...And contrary to popular belief, you can only do so much with force bubbles and energy beams. It got old quick in the cartoons, it'd get old in comics and live action tv/movies just as fast. You can do a lot more with a fifty feet tall mecha. Seeing regular energy blast through a wall is nowhere near as appealing to the eye as a guy creating a giant bull, a half dozen firemen, or a green Kool-Aid guy.
There have been a bunch of example in the comics. The ring has been used, for instance, to form a lock pick when blasting the door would be too loud. Soranik has made intricate surgical elements. Disguises. Tools. Etc.
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Old 01-02-2020, 03:19 AM   #14968
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And contrary to popular belief, you can only do so much with force bubbles and energy beams. It got old quick in the cartoons, it'd get old in comics and live action tv/movies just as fast. You can do a lot more with a fifty feet tall mecha. Seeing regular energy blast through a wall is nowhere near as appealing to the eye as a guy creating a giant bull, a half dozen firemen, or a green Kool-Aid guy.
Absolutely! As much as I appreciate the overall writing of the JL/JLU 'toon, it did John a huge disservice by never allowing him to create anything intricate. I often tell fans who love the show but who have never read the comics that they don't really know John. Yes, his personality was on-target and Lamarr's voice work was excellent, but the show rarely gave us any clue as to why he's known as the "Master Builder" in the DC Universe.
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Old 01-02-2020, 03:25 AM   #14969
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Originally Posted by Ωmega Man View Post
Comics were made for kids originally. Sounds to me like he's barely a fan of GL or any monthly comic for that matter and on the wrong forum. It's hilarious how somebody who doesn't read anything wants to trash the medium and specific titles on the regular. He might as well be one of those women who doesn't read comics but feels the need to bitch about how women are drawn in them like they DO read them.

And contrary to popular belief, you can only do so much with force bubbles and energy beams. It got old quick in the cartoons, it'd get old in comics and live action tv/movies just as fast. You can do a lot more with a fifty feet tall mecha. Seeing regular energy blast through a wall is nowhere near as appealing to the eye as a guy creating a giant bull, a half dozen firemen, or a green Kool-Aid guy.
That's one of the reasons that GL is my "go to" DC Comic. Even if I'm lukewarm to the latest DC event or even the current GL storyline, there are always Lanterns using the rings in new and interesting ways. If nothing else, GL always succeeds visually.

Quote:
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There have been a bunch of example in the comics. The ring has been used, for instance, to form a lock pick when blasting the door would be too loud. Soranik has made intricate surgical elements. Disguises. Tools. Etc.
Some of those moments where the rings are used to make things outside of weaponry are key parts of good stories. The example of Soranik's surgical implements is one of the best.
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Old 01-04-2020, 02:59 PM   #14970
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Maybe some of you guys should forget about comics and think about creating a television series.

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Old 01-10-2020, 04:39 PM   #14971
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Personally I'd like to see the Earth 1 version of GL adopted as a film; heavy Star Wars vibes with a superhero paint job. I would use Wayne Barlowe as the creature designer for all the aliens as well, make it something truly mind blowing to see on the big screen.
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