Birds of Prey (and the Fantabulous Emancipation of One Harley Quinn)

[Andrew NDB Shot Caller Find all posts View Profile Close Andrew NDB]

So it's bombing hard now. And look at this. It turns out that 53% of audiences seeing the movie are actually male:

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/ne...pening-1277792

The big girl power movie, and women it was "for" (that's what they told us) didn't even show up. Also, come to think of it, they can't even point to the R-rating. Think about it. "Suicide Squad" was PG-13 and came out in 2016... it's 2020 now, so anyone who was 13 then would be 17 now. Meaning, they can watch R-rated movies now, and any of "Harley's fans who couldn't go and see her in 'Birds of Prey' because of the rating."

So I wonder what they'll point to?

[Space Cop The Dandy Find all posts View Profile Close Space Cop]

So it's bombing hard now. And look at this. It turns out that 53% of audiences seeing the movie are actually male:

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/ne...pening-1277792

The big girl power movie, and women it was "for" (that's what they told us) didn't even show up. Also, come to think of it, they can't even point to the R-rating. Think about it. "Suicide Squad" was PG-13 and came out in 2016... it's 2020 now, so anyone who was 13 then would be 17 now. Meaning, they can watch R-rated movies now, and any of "Harley's fans who couldn't go and see her in 'Birds of Prey' because of the rating."

So I wonder what they'll point to?

One Youtube channel I watch (Cereal at Midnight) gave a semi-positive review of this, but noted the R thing being a stupid way to go.

+ YouTube Video

I'm still hoping to see it (though I won't cry if I miss it in theaters), but pretty much only for Robbie.

[Andrew NDB Shot Caller Find all posts View Profile Close Andrew NDB]

One Youtube channel I watch (Cereal at Midnight) gave a semi-positive review of this, but noted the R thing being a stupid way to go.

It was unnecessary, but did provide for a couple of chuckles throughout. "Suicide Squad," now that would have been helped by an R-rating, with what they were trying to do.

[Space Cop The Dandy Find all posts View Profile Close Space Cop]

It was unnecessary, but did provide for a couple of chuckles throughout. "Suicide Squad," now that would have been helped by an R-rating, with what they were trying to do.

Yeah, it does seem like they reversed that.

[Michael Heide Heide Finition Find all posts View Profile Close Michael Heide]

There was no reason for Batman v Superman Extended nor Birds of Prey to be R-Rated.
And there was no reason for Suicide Squad, not to be.

[Big Blue Lantern Corps Honor Guard Find all posts View Profile Close Big Blue Lantern]

This was a serviceable film that I'll certainly purchase on Blu-ray. It doesn't fire on all cylinders, but it's hardly without merit.

Margot as Harley carried the load here. I'm glad that BoP didn't shy away from her past with Joker as it was necessary to recall some of what we saw in Suicide Squad. From the frenetic action scenes to the zany motivations to the kaleidoscope of visuals, everything about Harley was on target.

The narrative that revolved around the diamond was decent. It didn't feel particularly inspired, but it didn't turn into a MacGuffin chase either. With all of the various characters coming from very different angles, this movie did more to establish Batman's backdrop than any of the DCEU films that actually featured Batman. I can certainly appreciate that.

As for what didn't work, Black Mask and Huntress seemed to be swept away in the campiness at the expense of their characters. I can't say that I've read any stories with Sionis since DC Rebirth, but his back story and personality are very dark. We got some of that with his propensity for torture, but he was also insecure and goofy. That seemed out of character, as did the awkwardness of Huntress.

Renee Montoya was the most interesting character in the film outside of Harley. I hadn't seen Rosie Perez in a few years and I had forgotten just how much skill she can bring to the screen. She provided a much-needed grounding to the film when it could have gone off the rails at certain points.

It will be interesting to see if there's an extended cut to this film. I was pleasantly surprised that a film with so many female characters didn't immediately become an exercise in lewdness. I didn't want to see that, nor did the film need to be that. However, I wouldn't mind seeing a little more of the Joker-Harley break-up if WB wants to give us that.

[Space Cop The Dandy Find all posts View Profile Close Space Cop]

Some theater chains change marquee title to Harley Quinn: Birds of Prey after poor opening weekend

[Michael Heide Heide Finition Find all posts View Profile Close Michael Heide]

I don't think that the previous marketing had downplayed Harley's role too much. But sure, if they think that it helps?

[Parrylakks Neko Samurai Find all posts View Profile Close Parrylakks]

There was no reason for Batman v Superman Extended nor Birds of Prey to be R-Rated.
And there was no reason for Suicide Squad, not to be.

BvS pulled the R rating for burning the pile of dead people and all the blood spatter during Batman's warehouse attack. Most of the extension was stuff removed for time, but that little bit of extra violence just pushed it over the edge. It wasn't a calculated decision, it was just happenstance, and the fact that Suicide Squad's extended cut wasn't rated indicates that WB was probably afraid of it happening again, so they just didn't send the extended cut to the MPAA.

But after two successful Deadpool films, and their own Joker film hitting it big, they decided to let Birds of Prey keep its filmed for rating... and it's shooting them in the foot. Harley isn't Deadpool, and Joker was a fluke of media controversy pushing against a critical success of a film peaking extra interest and word of mouth. Had it not been so successful, I suspect Birds of Prey would've been cut down to a PG-13 theatrical release, and the extended cut would've been this R rated version sans the rating, a la Suicide Squad. But that's how it should've been anyway. You don't up the rating of a franchise to R after six movies and hope to maintain your established PG-13 audience. It doesn't work that way.

Unfortunately, WB will likely learn the wrong lesson here, and shy away from the R rating in general for awhile. How much you wanna bet that Matrix 4 is PG-13?

[Michael Heide Heide Finition Find all posts View Profile Close Michael Heide]

It was Robbie who pushed for the hard R Rating. She produced the movie, and she didn't want it to be seen as a "chick flick", so she Kick-Assed it up eight notches. I can't say that it worked, but we'll see what word of mouth does in week 2.

[Andrew NDB Shot Caller Find all posts View Profile Close Andrew NDB]

You don't up the rating of a franchise to R after six movies and hope to maintain your established PG-13 audience. It doesn't work that way.

So you think that people that are already at least 17 years old wouldn't go to see Birds of Prey because it's an R-rated movie? They would feel alienated?

That's an... interesting stance. I don't think it's right, but it's interesting.

Unfortunately, WB will likely learn the wrong lesson here, and shy away from the R rating in general for awhile. How much you wanna bet that Matrix 4 is PG-13?

Aw man, I wouldn't even go and see it if it was PG-13.

[Parrylakks Neko Samurai Find all posts View Profile Close Parrylakks]

So you think that people that are already at least 17 years old wouldn't go to see Birds of Prey because it's an R-rated movie? They would feel alienated?

That's an... interesting stance. I don't think it's right, but it's interesting.

Living in Utah, you get a unique perspective on the rating system. My 36 year old brother, for instance, refuses to watch R rated movies (as do many Mormons, Protestants, and other religious denominations). He's made only one exception for this ever, and it was BvS, but only because the BD release had to come with it, and he didn't want it on DVD, but even then, he didn't watch it until I told him why the R rating was earned, and he talked about it with his wife. But something like Birds of Prey? There's no way he'll see it until it get edited for TV or Vudu's new Family Play feature.

Meanwhile, you have to remember that PG-13 doesn't mean 13 year olds. There are a lot of people who let their little kids watch PG-13 movies, especially superhero films, who wouldn't want them watching R rated films until they're a bit older -- say 15 or so. So you could have a kid who was 6 when Suicide Squad came out, but is only 10 now, and can't see it.

There's also the introduction of such films to your kids. Going back to that same brother of mine, his oldest kid turned 13 last year, and has since been allowed to watch PG-13 movies, so last year she watched all the Marvel and DC movies... but she's only going to be 14 this year, and her parents won't let her watch R rated film until she can make that decision for herself, so another 3 years out or so, but even then, given how she's been raised and her current attitudes, I'd find it unlikely that she'll seek out movies that have earned the R rating.

Lots of little things like this add up to a big chunk of the fanbase being alienated right out of the gate, and for what? A few F-words and some blood? Doesn't seem like a very good business decision to me.

[Tazer That Evil, Yellow Bastiche Find all posts View Profile Close Tazer]

Yo.

This was a serviceable film that I'll certainly purchase on Blu-ray. It doesn't fire on all cylinders, but it's hardly without merit.

I'm curious: how close to her comic roots was movie- Cassie Cain??

Meanwhile, you have to remember that PG-13 doesn't mean 13 year olds. There are a lot of people who let their little kids watch PG-13 movies, especially superhero films, who wouldn't want them watching R rated films until they're a bit older -- say 15 or so. So you could have a kid who was 6 when Suicide Squad came out, but is only 10 now, and can't see it.

wait a minnit: I thought pg-13 meant nobody under 13yo could get in w/o an adult/ being supervised.....right?

also, I came across this and couldn't help but to share:

Birds of Prey Fans and Punisher Creator Gerry Conway Blame Film’s Poor Opening on Men and Misogyny

.....this has me rather pissed, and I kinda want to NOT see the movie just to spite him & ppl like him. :/




Tazer

[Mister Ed Horse of a Different Color Find all posts View Profile Close Mister Ed]

So women are flocking to see this? I assume so, because if MEN are to blame for the poor box office, then women MUST be doing their part, right? Or are the evil men not only avoiding the film, but also keeping women away who want to go?

[Space Cop The Dandy Find all posts View Profile Close Space Cop]

Living in Utah, you get a unique perspective on the rating system. My 36 year old brother, for instance, refuses to watch R rated movies (as do many Mormons, Protestants, and other religious denominations). He's made only one exception for this ever, and it was BvS, but only because the BD release had to come with it, and he didn't want it on DVD, but even then, he didn't watch it until I told him why the R rating was earned, and he talked about it with his wife. But something like Birds of Prey? There's no way he'll see it until it get edited for TV or Vudu's new Family Play feature.

Meanwhile, you have to remember that PG-13 doesn't mean 13 year olds. There are a lot of people who let their little kids watch PG-13 movies, especially superhero films, who wouldn't want them watching R rated films until they're a bit older -- say 15 or so. So you could have a kid who was 6 when Suicide Squad came out, but is only 10 now, and can't see it.

There's also the introduction of such films to your kids. Going back to that same brother of mine, his oldest kid turned 13 last year, and has since been allowed to watch PG-13 movies, so last year she watched all the Marvel and DC movies... but she's only going to be 14 this year, and her parents won't let her watch R rated film until she can make that decision for herself, so another 3 years out or so, but even then, given how she's been raised and her current attitudes, I'd find it unlikely that she'll seek out movies that have earned the R rating.

Lots of little things like this add up to a big chunk of the fanbase being alienated right out of the gate, and for what? A few F-words and some blood? Doesn't seem like a very good business decision to me.

Yeah, there's a lot of that in my circles (Presbyterian), but less than I used to hear in the 80s and 90s. I don't mind anyone being careful about what they're watching or censoring their children, but it seems a bit silly to assume that the ratings system is somehow Biblical or godly as if there's nothing offensive until you get to 'R.'

So women are flocking to see this? I assume so, because if MEN are to blame for the poor box office, then women MUST be doing their part, right? Or are the evil men not only avoiding the film, but also keeping women away who want to go?

Nope. I heard (though I don't have the stats before me) that men were actually the larger and disproportionate audience, but that doesn't make for a good story, so who cares about facts?