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Old 01-15-2021, 03:52 AM   #176
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Typical liberal. Tries to start a discussion and backpedals.
Someone didn’t click the link to see the definition of what you’re doing.

Yes making Black Panther, the king of an African country, is changing his character just like changing Alan into a gay man. That doesn’t mean it’s the same thing. It’s not like turning Alan gay for an alternate reality book and a TV show changes his entire character like making Black Panther a white man would. At worst, Alan had Jade and Obsidian because he was in the closet. So generally still the same. White Panther would be a completely different story.

Be more like Space Cop.

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^I don't think it's a matter of reflecting or not reflecting the world. It's re-writing the history of a brand to sell a political view.

If you were making all new characters and reflected the diversity as you'd likely come across it, that would be one thing. For instance, if you were making a story about a bunch of twenty-somethings living in modern NYC, it would ridiculous to have them all be straight, white males.

But they're re-writing the narrative; de-emphasizing the characters that have been the long-standing focus because they are inconveniently straight males.

Alan Scott isn't gay. A short-lived alternate-reality version was. But they will present that version (and likely in marketing promote it as THE comic version) because they can get extra points. Ditto if Guy is presented as some neanderthal example of toxic masculinity. That's not being true to the core of the franchise. It's pandering.

I mean I can see how that would appeal to some, but I'm sure you can see how that could also be an insult to Alan and Guy fans or even (by their absence) Hal, John, and Kyle fans?
He logically makes his argument.



FYI They’re making T’Challa Star Lord for an episode of What If so you can throw a hissy over that too.
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Old 01-15-2021, 05:45 AM   #177
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Someone didn’t click the link to see the definition of what you’re doing.

Yes making Black Panther, the king of an African country, is changing his character just like changing Alan into a gay man. That doesn’t mean it’s the same thing. It’s not like turning Alan gay for an alternate reality book and a TV show changes his entire character like making Black Panther a white man would. At worst, Alan had Jade and Obsidian because he was in the closet. So generally still the same. White Panther would be a completely different story.

.


For the umteanth time i find alternative realities really lazy by the writers. How about sticking to one continuity and reality and flesh out characters that are gay women or people of color? Your telling me black panther is marvels only black hero? Lets look at dc new batman is black right? Batman is batman do to his tragedy not for being a white billionare playboy. People argue above all the different robins i tell them for me dick grayson is the only robin or batman Should never have a sidekick . Now thats my personal thought. Instead of tokenism why not you know make black lighting the face of black heros since 1. His show on cw is successful 2. He runs the jl on young justice outsiders. You want to tuck away ICON who is basically a black superman but want to replace kal EL with a black superman with a brand new black alter ego? Wouldn't it be less of a headache to revive Icon instead? Why sacrifice a character for the multiverse wich you know will be trash? You are aware there are white Africans who live in southern Africa right? So basically since you argued African country a white person can be black panther. Also i enjoy being me and i think its insulting to space cop to say i Should be like him. Space cop is a good dude
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Old 01-24-2021, 04:51 PM   #178
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For the umteanth time i find alternative realities really lazy by the writers. How about sticking to one continuity and reality and flesh out characters that are gay women or people of color? Your telling me black panther is marvels only black hero? Lets look at dc new batman is black right? Batman is batman do to his tragedy not for being a white billionare playboy. People argue above all the different robins i tell them for me dick grayson is the only robin or batman Should never have a sidekick . Now thats my personal thought. Instead of tokenism why not you know make black lighting the face of black heros since 1. His show on cw is successful 2. He runs the jl on young justice outsiders. You want to tuck away ICON who is basically a black superman but want to replace kal EL with a black superman with a brand new black alter ego? Wouldn't it be less of a headache to revive Icon instead? Why sacrifice a character for the multiverse wich you know will be trash? You are aware there are white Africans who live in southern Africa right? So basically since you argued African country a white person can be black panther. Also i enjoy being me and i think its insulting to space cop to say i Should be like him. Space cop is a good dude
I think there's just a failure to communicate here and you've got a lot on your mind LOL

Nobody said Black Panther was Marvel's only black hero. And it's obvious he isn't with folks like Luke Cage and War Machine running around. And for the record there WAS a light skinned Panther within the last few years, dude's name was even Casper LOL. You are correct in that we have a new black Batman at DC, but IDK why everybody's acting like he's the first. Michael Lane was brainwashed and put in a Batman suit during Battle for the Cowl and eventually became the second Azrael. There was also Stan Lee's Batman. And yeah, the tragedy was definitely a part of Batman's origin but by no means is it the only thing that makes him Batman. Being an entitled white billionaire is what got him training around the world, and helps finance his war on crime. Without his money and resources Batman would be more like Nightfist from Hitman. Or just a regular guy with severe PTSD.

Now for some reason you've segued into Robins, all of which have been mostly white males in continuity. But before the world went full on SJW... back in the 90's... it was revealed Dick Grayson was part Romanian. Thankfully DC hasn't felt the need to remind us with every appearance like they do with Kyle Rayner being part Mexican and speaking Spanish out of nowhere.

As far as Black Lightning... I've wanted DC to do more with him and Bronze Tiger for years. Instead they only push the easy tech based characters like Steel, Cyborg, and Mr. Terrific. As for his CW series... you know it's been cancelled right? Either way he should be in the League, not stuck in Batman's Outsiders.

With Icon.... I think Milestone dropped the ball even with the newest revamp. I would have rather the best of Milestone just be inserted into the mainstream DCU like in the Young Justice cartoon. I think part of DC's problem though is they've purchased too many universes and aren't doing much with the majority of them. People have wanted a Question series forever, and then finally... he gets a mini series. And somehow Rorschach gets a 12 issue maxi series by Tom King no less. I miss seeing folks like Captain Atom regularly, Hawkman now that his series ended, the 90's Ray, etc. I think DC is missing an opportunity not expanding the Justice League into the Justice League Unlimited and adding a couple dozen members.

And since you ended talking about Black Panther again, I'd urge you to look up that Casper dude who became the Panther when he was in NYC for a time. Eventually he became another version of White Tiger but was then forgotten when the Spiderman cartoons introduced the new female White Tiger.

-Ω

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Old 01-26-2021, 04:33 AM   #179
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With Icon.... I think Milestone dropped the ball even with the newest revamp.
I'm a little surprised DC never took the Milestone guys, some of the GEN13, and sort of spread them around the Justice League, Titans, and/or Teen Titans. Or have they? It seems like the most obvious thing.
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Old 01-26-2021, 10:43 AM   #180
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Things are strangely quiet on show details. It wouldn't surprise me if there is some kind of delay due to the virus.
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Old 02-04-2021, 04:45 AM   #181
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I think surving a voyage on the titanic in a sea of icebergs is more exciting and good than this pc woke garbage being a hit. Itll probably tank lower than batgirl season 2 episode 1's rating
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Old 02-10-2021, 02:28 AM   #182
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I'm a little surprised DC never took the Milestone guys, some of the GEN13, and sort of spread them around the Justice League, Titans, and/or Teen Titans. Or have they? It seems like the most obvious thing.
They tried it during the New52 to little success. Grifter could've been DC's gun guy from Wildstorm, Gen13 folded into that universe's Superboy and Teen Titans books, and Static was cancelled after his book's artist was given more power than Static's original co-creator that was the writer on the book.

Had Grifter got the crossover with Superman and Hawkman instead of being given to Rob Liefeld it might've lasted longer. Had somebody other than Scott Lobdell been over Superboy, Teen Titans, and.. I think it was called Ravagers... they might've been more of a hit. Static was just sad and I think what lead to Milestone separating from the mainstream DCU again.

In Flash #750 the Wildstorm universe and New52 combined universe was shown when God-Wally observed the entire DCU's multiverse and reboots.
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Old 02-11-2021, 03:25 PM   #183
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Im guessing alan scott will have a vaginis a hybrid of a vagina and penis to please the weirdos out there. The first episode will be him inspecting a stool sample and the ring on his finger wont be green but brown
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Old 05-29-2021, 03:16 PM   #184
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And sure enough, they use language such as "came out as gay" and "famous gay comics character" like Alan was always really gay:

DC finally casts gay Green Lantern — but raises new questions

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After weeks of reports, HBO Max has officially filled the role of Alan Scott, the original Green Lantern of Earth who came out as gay in the pages of DC Comics, for the upcoming Lantern series from Arrowverse architect Greg Berlanti. And... well, it's the guy from that Roland Emmerich Stonewall movie that we all collectively tried to forget.

Also known for movies like War Horse and Mamma Mia! Here We Go Again, and shows like Treadstone and Life Bites, actor Jeremy Irvine confirmed his casting in a post shared on Instagram Thursday.

"Very excited to be joining the DC Universe!! Can't wait to get started. #GreenLantern," Irvine wrote. He then shared the oath of the Latern Corps: "In brightest day, in blackest night/ No evil shall escape my sight/ Let those who worship evil's might/ Beware my power — Green Lantern's light!"

The significance of this character is clear to anyone who's even skimmed through comic book Twitter over the years. In addition to being Earth's first hero to bear the Green Lantern name and one of the founding members of the Justice Society of America, Alan came out of the closet in 2012, making him one of the most prominent depictions of LGBTQ characters in comic books. More recently, he spoke on the page about his experience being gay in the issue Infinite Frontier #0.

For the new show, which spans decades, Alan will feature in the year 1941 as a secretly gay FBI agent. This marks the first time the character will appear on screen in live-action in a way that addresses his sexuality. He's a precious character to many comic fans — which raises questions regarding this latest casting.

Irvine has proven himself to be an impressive actor, though it's hard to divorce his portrayal of a famous gay comics hero from that widely loathed movie, in which he played a gay man in the midst of the most well-known moment in the American LGBTQ rights movement.

Irvine starred in Stonewall, which was criticized for its whitewashing of the Stonewall riots, as Danny Winters. The character was fictionalized and not based on any one real-life figure. Instead of focusing on trans and queer revolutionaries that spearheaded the movement, like Marsha P. Johnson, Emmerich's film framed the story around Danny. One scene even saw the character take the famous Stonewall brick from the hands of a queer person of color and throw it himself to spark the movement — a perfect symbol for how the film took the story of Black and Brown queer people away from them and claimed it as something else . . . [cont. in article]
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Old 05-29-2021, 05:46 PM   #185
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And sure enough, they use language such as "came out as gay" and "famous gay comics character" like Alan was always really gay:

DC finally casts gay Green Lantern — but raises new questions
Sigh i thought originally alan scotts weakness was wood but i guess now its a wanted thing for him
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Old 06-14-2021, 12:14 AM   #186
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Alan as a secretly gay FBI agent? Seriously? 80 years worth of stories isn't good enough, they go with the gay angle and give him a job he's NEVER had... sounds like piss poor fanfic.
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Old 06-14-2021, 08:21 PM   #187
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And sure enough, they use language such as "came out as gay" and "famous gay comics character" like Alan was always really gay:

DC finally casts gay Green Lantern — but raises new questions
They said he "came out of the closet in 2012". What the heck? I forget, was that when the Earth 2 series was? Somebody didn't do enough research to realize that was a totally different character, if so.
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Old 06-16-2021, 03:01 AM   #188
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They said he "came out of the closet in 2012". What the heck? I forget, was that when the Earth 2 series was? Somebody didn't do enough research to realize that was a totally different character, if so.
Yes, that was from the Earth 2 series when that version came out. I thought that the version we saw in the GL 80th series was an amalgam of the Golden Age Alan and the New 52 Earth 2 Alan, but after Death Metal and the idea that "everything has happened somewhere", that should logically mean that the current Alan just came out as gay in Infinite Frontier, and that the Earth 2 Alan from 2012 isn't the same Alan.
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Old 06-16-2021, 12:05 PM   #189
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Yes, that was from the Earth 2 series when that version came out. I thought that the version we saw in the GL 80th series was an amalgam of the Golden Age Alan and the New 52 Earth 2 Alan, but after Death Metal and the idea that "everything has happened somewhere", that should logically mean that the current Alan just came out as gay in Infinite Frontier, and that the Earth 2 Alan from 2012 isn't the same Alan.
Assuming the show is based on any of the runs you and ed are discussing. Knowing berlantie's record with every show he has been involved with so far he has to have a gay character in every show. You may think im homophobic im not because homophobia is fear of gays and gays dont scare me . I just dont need to see it everywhere nor do i have to be forced to recognize it nor should i be judged persicuted punished or labeled for having a rational realistic opinion on the subject. If i wrote a alternative reality where harvey milk the first openly gay politician as a straight guy would it be accepted or will people who need there scientificaly created lady parts throw a fit saying a straight white male is not allowing a gay figure be recognized? Isn't it odd you only see white straight characters slowly being phased out?
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Old 06-16-2021, 12:48 PM   #190
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...You may think im homophobic im not because homophobia is fear of gays and gays dont scare me...
Totally apart from my religious/sociological views, I hate the term just linguistically. (1) it only means "fear of same", which could be anything (fear of homo sapiens; fear of homogenized milk; fear of homeopathic medicine) (2) if you're in a community being oppressed, it doesn't really matter whether your persecutor is afraid of you. The issue is the oppression, not the debatable psychology behind it. I used to have a lesbian friend who just said "anti-gay." That's much more linguistically appropriate.
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Old 06-16-2021, 01:44 PM   #191
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Totally apart from my religious/sociological views, I hate the term just linguistically. (1) it only means "fear of same", which could be anything (fear of homo sapiens; fear of homogenized milk; fear of homeopathic medicine) (2) if you're in a community being oppressed, it doesn't really matter whether your persecutor is afraid of you. The issue is the oppression, not the debatable psychology behind it. I used to have a lesbian friend who just said "anti-gay." That's much more linguistically appropriate.
Right! Its used in everything now if you simply dont agree on something. I had some jagoff who i dont even know on social media say im a ignorant trans phobe because i dont believe theres more than 2 genders. Until men can pop a kid out of there womb and breast feed have there period or go through menopause i dont wanna hear men can be women or vice versa or now be called birthing parent to not offend the weirdos. I would love a biological born woman explain how she knows what its like to have a dick that gets us real men in trouble or how they think like a man . And before people bring up suicide suicide happens its not exclusive to just lgbtq. Its interesting how people only focus on suicide rates for lgbtq but ignore the others making lgbtq the top priority. A childhood friend of mine hung herself a month before her wedding her 5 year old kid found her this was in 2013 . The Media Wouldn't care because shes a straight white woman. Its only important if your a gay trans minority now a days because straight white people are evil
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Old 06-21-2021, 06:19 AM   #192
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Assuming the show is based on any of the runs you and ed are discussing
It will likely be loosely based when it comes to Alan's history. Since the show is called Green Lantern Corps, and we know that this version is young a gay, that's two departures from the Golden Age telling. The show will pick and choose what it wants to include, and hopefully it's done in a way that works with the overall narrative.
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Old 06-21-2021, 11:54 AM   #193
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It will likely be loosely based when it comes to Alan's history. Since the show is called Green Lantern Corps, and we know that this version is young a gay, that's two departures from the Golden Age telling. The show will pick and choose what it wants to include, and hopefully it's done in a way that works with the overall narrative.
Yea because identity politics has really done well with ratings have you seen the NBA and NFL they had very low ratings ? only a matter of time before batwoman is cancelled . Season 2 has done horrible for viewers. Heck even the cleavland show wich spunoff from family guy was cancelled after like 1 season nobody in the black community watched it. I just find it hypocritical to assume if you race gender or sexuality swap that particular audience will tune in. My older brother is openly gay he dosent give a fuck about comic books nor do making characters gay make him want to start reading them. How about quit the pc bs trying to please everyone and write good stories? You wanna do allan scott do the characher how he originally was. Im sure if we held a poll the votes would show nobody wants a gay allan scott for his tv debut and you Would have to eat crow and accept those results. Make his show set in the 40s as a period piece how it should be . Dont add current crap to it
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Old 06-22-2021, 06:14 AM   #194
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Yea because identity politics has really done well with ratings have you seen the NBA and NFL they had very low ratings ?
Once again, I'm not sure how you got on to this topic from the development of GL. I don't watch much NFL these days because the rule changes over the last 15 years or so have made the game a slog to watch. I don't know how their ratings are doing or what you see that is "identity politics."

As for the NBA, they're currently in the midst of a massive bump in viewership:

https://www.boston.com/sports/nba/20...e-fans-return/

But all of this is irrelevant. My original point is that the indicators are that the HBO Max version of Alan Scott will drawn from the various comic incarnations and not a single version.
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Old 06-22-2021, 01:15 PM   #195
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Once again, I'm not sure how you got on to this topic from the development of GL. I don't watch much NFL these days because the rule changes over the last 15 years or so have made the game a slog to watch. I don't know how their ratings are doing or what you see that is "identity politics."

As for the NBA, they're currently in the midst of a massive bump in viewership:

https://www.boston.com/sports/nba/20...e-fans-return/

But all of this is irrelevant. My original point is that the indicators are that the HBO Max version of Alan Scott will drawn from the various comic incarnations and not a single version.
You say its irrelevant because you dont have a leg to stand on. As i suggested lets open a voting poll asking if true allan scott fans want him to be gay for his first live action debut because regardless the iterations there using hes stil gay. The overall argument is woke politics in everything now a days. You cant convince me that you yourself aren't a little irked by phasing out straight white male characters in movies tv and comics. You can think im racist sexist or homophobic but i refuse to bury my head in the sand and allow cancel culture to run everything. Next thing you know xmen will drop men from the title and replace it with x people to not offend the non gender pro noun weirdos.
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Old 06-23-2021, 04:02 AM   #196
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You say its irrelevant because you dont have a leg to stand on.
I said that only because this is about the HBO Max show, not the NFL or NBA. I don't see what they have to do with one another.
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Old 06-23-2021, 04:08 AM   #197
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Toby Emmerich suggests that HBO Max shows might cross over with DC films.

https://newsnationusa.com/news/enter...ts-on-hbo-max/
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Old 06-23-2021, 12:12 PM   #198
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As i suggested lets open a voting poll asking if true allan scott fans want him to be gay for his first live action debut...
Two things...

One: this isn't Alan Scott's live action debut. He appeared in the double length JSA episode of Smallville season 9 titled "Absolute Justice" (which was later split into a two parter for syndication with the titles "Society" and "Legends").

Two: I really don't think there are any "true" Alan Scott fans.

Don't get me wrong, I like Alan Scott -- probably a lot more than most Green Lantern fans, as I really enjoyed his time as Sentinel, and it got me to read a bunch of his old stuff -- but I don't care enough to be angry about it. Sure, I've said a few times in conversation with friends that I think it's unfortunate they took a character that was best known as a dedicated family man with a very important biological daughter and turned him gay, but at the same time I don't care enough to be upset by the change.

In fact, I kinda get it.

While there are other gay characters in the DCU, they didn't really have one that was a big part of a focused canon. As such, taking a character with a fairly small fanbase, mostly just from the limited GL and/or JSA core, and making him gay while positioning him as a center piece of a secondary world makes sense. Honestly, I'm surprised they didn't do it to someone more central to the primary world -- like Guy Gardner. But even if they had, I still don't think it would be a big deal. In fact, I could argue that that would probably have been a better fit, but only if I cared to do so, which I don't.

Basically what I'm saying is that it's pointless to get bent out of shape over something like this. I don't think your views indicate that you're particularly racist or homophobic, I just think you're letting "woke culture" to harm your enjoyment too much. Seriously, why does it even really matter?

I mean, it's not like they're making Batman a gay Asian who was raised by an African FTM transgender butler who once had a love affair with a cisgendered female Latinx police commissioner named Jamie.
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Old 06-23-2021, 12:57 PM   #199
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I said that only because this is about the HBO Max show, not the NFL or NBA. I don't see what they have to do with one another.
Can you honestly sit there and say it isnt happening? You say you have no issue with it and seriously i want to ask you do straight white male lives matter? Because your seeing such characters phased out . Dont be a little boy and dodge the question . Ditch the baby booster seat sippy cub and bib. man up
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Old 06-23-2021, 02:45 PM   #200
Mister Ed
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Originally Posted by Parrylakks View Post
Two things...

One: this isn't Alan Scott's live action debut. He appeared in the double length JSA episode of Smallville season 9 titled "Absolute Justice" (which was later split into a two parter for syndication with the titles "Society" and "Legends").

Two: I really don't think there are any "true" Alan Scott fans.

Don't get me wrong, I like Alan Scott -- probably a lot more than most Green Lantern fans, as I really enjoyed his time as Sentinel, and it got me to read a bunch of his old stuff -- but I don't care enough to be angry about it. Sure, I've said a few times in conversation with friends that I think it's unfortunate they took a character that was best known as a dedicated family man with a very important biological daughter and turned him gay, but at the same time I don't care enough to be upset by the change.
Did we actually get to see Alan Scott as an actual character in Smallville? I recall only some short flashbacks and images of the ring and battery. I thought that he was not one of the characters that actually appeared and had lines and everything. But it has been a while, so I could be misremembering.

And yeah, I've never been the hugest Alan Scott fan, either, despite enjoying his appearances with later GLs, and his role in the modern JSA comic.

The part that kind of grates on me about this situation is the revisionism. Not just in universe (that is to be expected, and retcons that are even less well-executed than this I've just rolled with in the past. Sure, him being a closeted gay man makes little sense given all the internal dialogue the readers have been privy to over the years, but ignoring that stuff is par for the course in many retcons), but in the news and announcements and stuff, where they won't own what they are doing.

Where they pretend that Alan is gay in the show because that's true to the comics (when really they did that in the comics because they were planning it for the show), or report that he was revealed to be gay years ago, when that was an alternate universe version that has nothing to do with the one they are clearly referencing from the comics. They aren't owning it as a deliberate change, but trying to pretend it was always this way.

But what that really means is I should just stop reading the press releases, I guess. It isn't like I commonly find myself in discussions about the history of Alan Scott with people I meet in real life...
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